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VCSY - A Laughing Place #2
Sunday, 12 June 2011
Time to Chew the Root
Mood:  cool
Now Playing: "The Cow's Cud" How bovine pucks are made (industrial exfoliation)
Topic: The Sneaky Runarounds

Here we are in history where the cattle have broken into the feed crops. They won't stop eating until the landowner has been consumed. There is no escape. There is only a price to be paid and it will be taken by those who will crap out the landowner's riches into the dirt.

It could have been different. But those who believe they are entitled to power have deluded themselves and left no way of escape.


Do Until:

By: moonpunk 10 Jun 2011, 01:03 PM EDT

Msg. 301979 of 302059

It's time we got down to brass tacks without a distraction. Time to Xray the frog.


By: moonpunk 10 Jun 2011, 01:33 PM EDT
Msg. 301984 of 302059

If you understood your enemy you wouldn't be so easy to manipulate. That is unless you don't mind the enemy manipulating.


By: moonpunk 10 Jun 2011, 01:35 PM EDT
Msg. 301985 of 302059

As you can see mirror is unable to answer the questions put to him. He's playing for time so the questions will fade and be buried.

That's how the game is played. If you want to stand in the street to slow the game down fine but TOS is a tool and if you don't use it you become useful as a tool.

I thought people would understand this sort of thing after being around for so long. Unfortunately some people wake up in a new world every day so it takes a while for them to learn.


By: moonpunk 10 Jun 2011, 01:37 PM EDT
Msg. 301987 of 302059

So mirror how is it Clearmethods is making such obvious headway in what you claim is an obsolete technology? The technology displayed by Clearmethods is a clear indication VCSY's technology is powerful and timely.


By: moonpunk 10 Jun 2011, 01:46 PM EDT
Msg. 301988 of 302059

And Apple couldn't develop their own synch methods so they had to rip off a student?

What's up with that? When you can you do. When you can't you work. Or you steal?

Synchronization of data is a fundamental part of interoperability. Without synchronization there is no virtualization.

VCSY's patents demonstrate sync as a basic quality. Apple had to delay virtualizing Leopard at the same time Microsoft had to delay virtualizing. Right after VCSY sued Microsoft in 2007.

Ten years is a long long time to show you don't have the goods.


By: mrrrfk 10 Jun 2011, 01:48 PM EDT
Msg. 301989 of 302059
(Reply to 301987 by moonpunk)

Clearmethods are small fry and there are plenty of other similar open source XML-based languages out there. They aren't very popular amongst developers, who dislike working with XML syntax. Homegrown extensions of XML overflooded the IT world years ago, which is one reason why it never caught on all that much, and is also why they had to invent HTML5. You're years behind the times, Portuno.
Emily who?


By: moonpunk 10 Jun 2011, 02:03 PM EDT
Msg. 301991 of 302059
(Reply to 301989 by mrrrfk)

mirror "there are plenty of other similar open source XML-based languages"

Show them to us and explain how they do what Clearmethods is able to do.

Clearmethods products are the closest thing to the VCSY IP description publicly seen in the industry. The fact you can't confront that means you haven't gotten your talking points yet. Probably because the guy writing the talking points is stymied and unable to confront so you get left hanging.

Smallfry or not their XML methods are doing things the rest of the industry can't do.

Ray Ozzie thought he could do it with RSS. That fried and the gang that thought they could pull it off are trying something different.

Apple can't do it and it shows.

If you can't explain your way out of the situation just say so.


By: mrrrfk 10 Jun 2011, 02:05 PM EDT
Msg. 301992 of 302059
(Reply to 301989 by mrrrfk)

Clear Methods' Language Gets Cool Greeting
The object-oriented language is being greeted with skepticism by programmers, development tool suppliers, and Web-services consultants.

By Charles Babcock InformationWeek

The notion that the world needs XML as a procedural programming language is being greeted with skepticism by programmers, development tool suppliers, and Web-services consultants.

"XML can be used to express procedural logic. It would be on the verbose side, but it can be done," said Sam Ruby, VP of the Apache Software Foundation, the open-source group that develops the Apache Web server. Ruby is also a member of Apache's XML Project Management Committee--that is, a programmer with the authority to commit new code to the Apache XML project's repository. "I don't see many people wanting to learn such a language. Perhaps such a language could have a niche as the target of code generation ... by a wizard in an IDE," he said in an E-mail response. Ruby is a Java programmer with IBM.

Water code would require the Steam Engine run-time environment. Clear Methods unveiled an upgraded version 3.10 of Steam Engine on July 15.

"A specialized run-time environment is a big minus," Ruby said. That's because the run-time environment must already be installed on target systems where Water code is slated to run, or a user must first download the engine and install it before getting the benefit of Water code, experienced programmers says. Users balk at downloads they don't understand or need approval from higher corporate authority to add to their desktops.

XML as a programming language "is a cute academic idea, but nothing more than that," Brad Young, director of product marketing for Zend Technologies Ltd., said in an E-mail. Zend produces an integrated development environment for the PHP scripting language, one of the Web-site languages that XML procedural logic might replace. "Programmers don't like coding in nested syntax, like XML."


By: mrrrfk 10 Jun 2011, 02:06 PM EDT
Msg. 301993 of 302059
(Reply to 301992 by mrrrfk)

XML as a programming language "is a cute academic idea, but nothing more than that," Brad Young, director of product marketing for Zend Technologies Ltd., said in an E-mail. Zend produces an integrated development environment for the PHP scripting language, one of the Web-site languages that XML procedural logic might replace. "Programmers don't like coding in nested syntax, like XML."


By: mrrrfk 10 Jun 2011, 02:07 PM EDT
Msg. 301994 of 302059
(Reply to 301992 by mrrrfk)

XML is already "an open standard for storing information and being able to transport it," says Tom Barrett, a partner at PricwaterhouseCoopers and a consultant on Web services. As such, it already includes much of the document-processing and data-movement capabilities that Clear Methods appears to be talking about on its Web site, he says.


By: mrrrfk 10 Jun 2011, 02:08 PM EDT
Msg. 301995 of 302059
(Reply to 301994 by mrrrfk)

But programmers, software tool suppliers, and Web-services consultants and analysts agreed that until there was a large base of programmers making use of Water, XML as a programming language was likely to be rare encounter on the Web.
"The big catch is developer acceptance," Bloomberg says. "Clear Methods is still pushing the snowball up the hill. It hasn't reached the point where it's rolling down the hill, gathering strength."


By: moonpunk 10 Jun 2011, 02:09 PM EDT
Msg. 301996 of 302059
(Reply to 301992 by mrrrfk)

That article is from July 21, 2003. And yet the list of partners and customers using that technology has grown since the Water language was deleted from wikipedia after you began discussing in on Yahoo.

So come up with something more substantial. Either that or admit you don't know because as the article says "XML can be used to express procedural logic". But you said it can't. And remember "ten years" of development has been popping up in all kinds of places recently where advanced computing using XML as a procedural language is being revealed.

As I've shown I am open to admitting when I'm wrong and I am willing to be shown to be wrong. So let's see how good you are.


By: danthomas 10 Jun 2011, 02:13 PM EDT
Msg. 301997 of 302059
(Reply to 301992 by mrrrfk)

mrr no date on your post.
I'll post the date for you.

July 21, 2003 10:00 AM

8 yrs old.
how is it doing now?


By: moonpunk 10 Jun 2011, 02:15 PM EDT
Msg. 301998 of 302059
(Reply to 301994 by mrrrfk)

That's true of XML as a traditional sense and is the reason the industry has been stagnant since Bil Gate's published his "Digital Decade" speech almost ten years ago. But what we're talking about here is VCSY patents saying they use XML to go beyond the traditional uses to form a basis for an all-XML language for procedures and functions.

VCSY's 6826744 and 7076521 patents show clearly you're wrong because the VCSY material in VCSY v LG and Samsung shows clearly 6826744's methods are used in Android.

I thought you said that idea was obsolete?

So Clearmethods using what can be easily shown to be VCSY IP is being used in MIT and IBM to build advanced systems. We know the basic foundation for IBM's Watson was established at MIT so you have a real problem trying to sweep that work away.

You need to do better than that or your friends will be upset with you.


By: moonpunk 10 Jun 2011, 02:16 PM EDT
Msg. 301999 of 302059
(Reply to 301995 by mrrrfk)

Like danthomas points out you always leave off dates in your references. Do you have a problem cutting and pasting article dates?

"until there was a large base of programmers making use of Water, XML as a programming language was likely to be rare encounter on the Web"

Looks like that's in the process of changing. Or can you explain why Water is being used by so many high profile advanced users?


By: mrrrfk 10 Jun 2011, 02:17 PM EDT
Msg. 302000 of 3 02059
(Reply to 301996 by moonpunk)

Clearmethods is old news. Like I said, you are years behind the times. Clear Methods is a tiny company working in a niche market of open source XML-based junk that most developers won't go near. Why don't you provide a more current link that says something good about them that isn't from Clearmethods. Oh let me guess; they are working in stealth mode, lol.


By: moonpunk 10 Jun 2011, 02:22 PM EDT
Msg. 302001 of 302059
(Reply to 302000 by mrrrfk)

You're years behind because you keep relying on articles that are almost ten years old when Teledyne, IBM, the US Army, the US Air Force, General Dynamics, MIT and others are using XML procedural and functional methods which you claim is obsolete.

There's something wrong with the way you're looking at things obviously.

Stealth? Given that most of the partners and customers are defense oriented I would think they should be working under a stealth operation.

You can try ridicule all you like but it doesn't remove the fact that you don't have anything to show for all your claims of knowledge. Try again.

"Pratt & Whitney is using Steam XML at the core of a mobile, distributed computing architecture to improve both supply chain efficiencies and customer support. Steam XML provides a secure, flexible software platform for their innovative wireless, embedded maintenance system. "


By: mrrrfk 10 Jun 2011, 02:30 PM EDT
Msg. 302002 of 302059

It looks like Clear Methods has done very little since 2009 when the 2 founders began working for TextMyFood which I am sure is going to revolutionize the IT industry, LMAO. The Clear Methods website hasn't been updated for years.


By: mrrrfk 10 Jun 2011, 02:36 PM EDT
Msg. 302004 of 302059

Man cannot live on Water alone, which must explain why the Clear Method founders now work for TextForFood (which is basically an Open Table ripoff.)


By: moonpunk 10 Jun 2011, 02:39 PM EDT
Msg. 302005 of 302059
(Reply to 302002 by mrrrfk)

Oh. So the Clearmethods company has been working with defense contractors for about 7 years and then they went on to work on their own thing in 2009?

That's interesting. So November 2009 is around the time when the Clearmethods founders were able to work out in the public with their IP.

Hmmm. And you claim that means the idea is dead? You said XML languages are all over the place. But then you say developers quit using them about seven years ago.

"Homegrown extensions of XML overflooded the IT world years ago, which is one reason why it never caught on all that much, and is also why they had to invent HTML5."

So all these public developers abandoned an XML version that could do everything they said they wanted and they turned around and invented an HTML version to do what they say they wanted and here we are five years later and HTML still doesn't do what developers could have been doing with XML all this time. That is if those developers could have gotten their hands on it during the time it was being matured with defense contractors.

Do you see how badly that kind of thinking does not make sense?

When something doesn't make sense it means somebody isn't telling the whole story. What are you afraid to say mirror?


By: moonpunk 10 Jun 2011, 02:40 PM EDT
Msg. 302006 of 302059
(Reply to 302004 by mrrrfk)

Water as Steam makes clouds.


By: moonpunk 10 Jun 2011, 02:42 PM EDT
Msg. 302007 of 302059

"Water and Steam have allowed us to consolidate what would normally be multiple code-generating layers of applications into a single software systems architecture approach that is powerful, adaptable and user-friendly.”"
- Dave Loda, founder and manager of the Applied Technologies Group, an internal innovation hub for United Technology's Pratt & Whitney division.

So now point to one of your HTML developers to show they are able to take "multiple code-generating layers of applications into a single software systems architecture".

And may I point something out in that statement? "multiple code-generating layers".

Do you understand what that means?


By: mrrrfk 10 Jun 2011, 02:52 PM EDT
Msg. 302008 of 302059
(Reply to 302005 by moonpunk)

Nope. TextMyFood is based on Ruby-on-Rails, a real modern-day programming language, not Water.
Their LinkedIn accounts tell us this:
(broken link)


By: mrrrfk 10 Jun 2011, 02:55 PM EDT
Msg. 302009 of 302059
(Reply to 302008 by mrrrfk)

Audrey J. Founder TextMyFood
Privately Held; Hospitality industry
November 2009 – Present (1 year 8 months)
Developed SMS/web-application software in Ruby-on-Rails
(broken link)


By: moonpunk 10 Jun 2011, 03:01 PM EDT
Msg. 302010 of 302059
(Reply to 302008 by mrrrfk)

The whole idea of an XML based programming environment is that the XML commands can wrap around any other language or code modules so the idea the Water founders are using nothing but ROR is pretty far fetched.

By the way "2010" was only six months ago. And you're saying the founders did nothing else from 2009 onward? Why do you think that's the case? Evidence? I would say the evidence shows MIT is using Water and Steam and has made great strides in using XML as a procedural and functional processing language. That's why IBM's Watson uses the XML-based foundation from MIT.

Your claim that XML based programming somehow mysteriously "died" years ago but continues to show up today doesn't make sense.

I really do wish you had experience and knowledge in this area so there could be a real conversation instead of all your specious dodges.


By: mrrrfk 10 Jun 2011, 03:04 PM EDT
Msg. 302011 of 302059

It only takes a few minutes of online dd to prove Portuno's BS to be wrong. I just can't resist raining water on his parade, sometimes. LOL.


By: mrrrfk 10 Jun 2011, 03:07 PM EDT
Msg. 302012 of 302059
(Reply to 302010 by moonpunk)

Don't try to change the subject. Tell us more about how Water is being used in TextMyFood. Oh right, it isn't, you just made that up because you saw that the Clear Methods founders are working their now, where Ruby-on-Rails is the dev platform. Oops!


By: moonpunk 10 Jun 2011, 03:15 PM EDT
Msg. 302013 of 302059
(Reply to 302011 by mrrrfk)

Nothing you've supplied pulls you out of the hole. Clearmethods along with all their partners and customers have been using the closest thing to VCSY's IP since 2001 and all the way to 2010 and you claim the founders are now using RoR exclusive of any of their techniques after all that time.

What kind of idiots to you take people for mirror? Is life that easy for you that you can tell people something that doesn't make sense and they just say "OK" and walk on?

The whole idea is to be able to use XML based concepts to wrap code and make the code agnostic. That's what the VCSY patents show. I would say Clearmethods has to honor the VCSY patents and patent pending work in public until Wade is ready to say so in public so their use of RoR isn't so odd or difficult to understand to me.

Work between the two should be interchangeable. Apparently you have a real problem understanding what XML code means. That's to be expected I suppose but it doesn't excuse you making things up.


By: moonpunk 10 Jun 2011, 03:20 PM EDT
Msg. 302014 of 302059
(Reply to 302008 by mrrrfk)

mirror You know nobody wants to accuse you of trickery but you've already said you enjoy lying because you think you're good at it so would you mind cutting and pasting the content from this link you supplied?
(broken link)

It would help everybody to know what was said there.


By: moonpunk 10 Jun 2011, 03:38 PM EDT
Msg. 302015 of 302059
(Reply to 302014 by moonpunk)

And if anyone else has access to Linkedin please post the content of the link mirror posted.

Meanwhile this from the same article mirror used.
Clear Methods' Language Gets Cool Greeting
The object-oriented language is being greeted with skepticism by programmers, development tool suppliers, and Web-services consultants.

By Charles Babcock InformationWeek
July 21, 2003 10:00 AM

"Water is a full-featured object-oriented programming language, expressed in XML. It does more than Java does," says Jason Bloomberg, an analyst with Zap Think, an XML-oriented research group. It was designed to include security measures in the code so that it can move safely over the network. Water has built-in restrictions that prohibit it from calling files off a user's hard drive or changing the system software where it resides, he adds. Because it uses XML syntax, "it's not learning a new language for seasoned developers. They're already conversant in with XML," Bloomberg notes.

So what's the problem? We all have to wait until 2022 for HTML5 to do what could be done back in 2003?

Does that make sense to anybody? ANYBODY?


By: mrrrfk 10 Jun 2011, 03:44 PM EDT
Msg. 302016 of 302059

Careers at TextMyFood

If you would like to apply for any of the openings posted below, please send your résumé and a cover letter to Phone calls or recruiter inquiries are not welcome.
Software Engineer
Location: Boston, MA

This position is responsible for software engineering, design, and development of client and server-side TextMyFood software modules. Tasks include writing functional specifications, design documentation, coding, unit testing, debugging, integration, performance tuning, and maintenance of assigned software modules. Provides information to documenters, testers and customer service personnel on features and functionality of software modules. Provide technical support with complex field issues. Covers all responsibilities of the Software Engineer position. May involve some on site work with clients. Other duties as assigned. Acts as individual contributor as well as team member. Usually works with little supervision, conferring with others in the department on unusual or extremely complex matters. Assignments are broad in nature, usually requiring originality and ingenuity. Has appreciable latitude for un-reviewed action. May provide guidance, assistance, and technical leadership to lower level software engineers on more complex/large projects. Errors may cause major costs or significant disruption to operations. Able to work effectively with product marketing and other TextMyFood personnel to clarify functional requirements, review software designs, etc. Able to explain software functionality from a user’s or customer’s perspective. Occasionally designs and presents technical presentations to a variety of audiences. Interacts internally/externally on an as needed basis to exchange information.

Bachelors degree in technical discipline (ideally in computer science or engineering), or equivalent experience. 2+ years of software design and development experience. Knowledge of appropriate programming languages, databases, and/or operating system technology, specifically including:

Ruby on Rails
REST Web services
UI development
iPhone experience desirable, but not required

- - - -

Gee, I see HTML5, but no Water or XML.


By: moonpunk 10 Jun 2011, 03:50 PM EDT
Msg. 302017 of 302059
(Reply to 302016 by mrrrfk)

That's it? THAT is your "proof"? How is it you take so little to "prove" what you believe but you absolutely refuse to consider a common sense explanation.

Why would they ask for somebody with experience with Water if they could teach any experienced developer what they own in a short time?

What is it with you?

"Bachelors degree in technical discipline (ideally in computer science or engineering), or equivalent experience. 2+ years of software design and development experience. Knowledge of appropriate programming languages, databases, and/or operating system technology, specifically including:

Ruby on Rails
REST Web services
UI development
iPhone experience"

All that modern experience and you think that person couldn't begin using something like Water from the moment they sat at their desk.

No wonder you didn't want to include the content in your original post.

Come on mirror. You have to do better than that. A kid can come up with a better ruse than that.


By: moonpunk 10 Jun 2011, 03:53 PM EDT
Msg. 302018 of 302059
(Reply to 302016 by mrrrfk)

You also fail to account for the fact Water is described in Clearmethods literature as a rapid prototyping language. I would expect that to be the stage all maturing development is done in defense environments to prove out the language's advantages over the course of time.

Are you ready to actually have a mature discussion about all this or are you going to do nothing but run around the bush in hopes you can dodge out?


By: moonpunk 10 Jun 2011, 04:07 PM EDT
Msg. 302019 of 302059

Why are you running over to Yahoo instead of dealing with the questions here mirror? Can't answer? Don't have a clue? Talked yourself into a hole?

How about staying here for a while and giving everyone a chance to watch how you work. I'm sure they'll all be really impressed.
"The language is as easy as BASIC and as powerful as LISP."

" programming in XML syntax with Water, you can streamline the creation of complex Web services–for example, how a complete Web service can be implemented in one line of code."

That's what a very high level language should be. It's the kind of thing Emily accomplishes. There's no doubt in my mind Wade knows all about Clearmethods and they've had some form of accommodation working for them to do so much work with US Defense and IBM at MIT.

So where's the "proof" in your LinkedIn post mirror? You didn't show any.


By: moonpunk 10 Jun 2011, 04:15 PM EDT
Msg. 302020 of 302059
(Reply to 302010 by moonpunk)

mirror This is from 2008.

I would think you would be excited to see this kind of thing given it would mesh perfectly with HTML5. It would give immediate high level automation capabilities to your favorite HTML5 Graphic User Interface.

In fact I don't see why an XML based code would be such a problem since any code module could be tagged and used for automation and control using something like Water.

But you don't like that at all. You say the only reasonable way for the software industry and their partners and customers to perform automation functions is to wait until Web Workers is accepted by a mountain of developers. You know. The same argument you claim stopped XML coding dead back in 2003. But we know you're wrong from what we've seen now.

VCSY IP is alive and well as demonstrated by what Clearmethods has done and demonstrated by the whitepaper descriptions of a much more effective and proficient use of developer time over existing traditional programming languages.


By: mrrrfk 10 Jun 2011, 04:18 PM EDT
Msg. 302021 of 302059
(Reply to 302019 by moonpunk)

Portuno, when are you gonna supply some current links from someone other than Clear Methods to hype Clear Methods? LOL.


By: mrrrfk 10 Jun 2011, 04:19 PM EDT
Msg. 302022 of 302059

About Clear Methods Inc
Clear Methods Inc in Cambridge, MA is a private company categorized under Website Design Service. Current estimates show this company has an annual revenue of $500,000 to $1 million and employs a staff of approximately 1 to 4.

Even VCSY is bigger than Clear Methods. In all fairness, was launched in 2005, so this info might be a few years old, but the fact is, the founders of TINY Clear Methods are now working for TextMyFood to put some food on their tables.



By: moonpunk 10 Jun 2011, 04:24 PM EDT
Msg. 302023 of 302059
(Reply to 302021 by mrrrfk)

You can ask portuno that on Yahoo but I would say when are you going to produce some more recent articles slamming XML based programming? 2003? Really. All the information I showed with XML at work is as close as 2010. What happened to all that "abandoned" work you claim happened?

AND when are you going to come up with a critique of Clearmethods IP from somebody other than Clearmethods competitors?< A=""> color="#ff0020">ClearMethods


By: moonpunk 10 Jun 2011, 04:26 PM EDT
Msg. 302025 of 302059
(Reply to 302022 by mrrrfk)


<>< A=""> color="#ff0020">ClearMethods#p/u/1/IT8vVAFXJGw


By: mrrrfk 10 Jun 2011, 04:31 PM EDT
Msg. 302026 of 302059
(Reply to 302025 by moonpunk)

That link is also from ClearMethods. Try again.


By: moonpunk 10 Jun 2011, 04:36 PM EDT
Msg. 302027 of 302059
(Reply to 302026 by mrrrfk)

Doesn't matter. It's reality. A reality you say doesn't exist. In fact you claim all that kind of work ended back in 2003 so everyone had to invent HTML5.

How wrong how wrong you are.

So when are you going to show me some examples of HTML5 that do what Water shows it can do? Come on mirror. Something small. I know HTML5 must be out there in secret somewhere doing what XML could do in 2003. There must be. Either that or you're trying to pull the wool over everbody's eyes here.

So let's see your examples. Chop chop little guy. You've been running long enough.


By: mrrrfk 10 Jun 2011, 04:50 PM EDT
Msg. 302028 of 302059

Top Programming Languages for 2011
Java has dominated the programming jobs rankings for the last several years and remains dominant going into 2011. According to Simply Hired, since April 2009, Java jobs increased 52 percent, Perl jobs increased 33 percent, C# jobs increased 52 percent, Objective C jobs increased 60 percent (however, a search for "Objective-C" showed a 207 percent increase in jobs), Visual Basic jobs increased 112 percent, JavaScript jobs increased 76 percent, Ruby jobs increased 78 percent, Python jobs increased 69 percent, C jobs increased 11 percent and PHP jobs increased 58 percent.


Where are all the XML-based programming languages?
portuno/moonpunk said they were being widely adopted. Bzzzt! WRONG.


By: moonpunk 10 Jun 2011, 04:58 PM EDT
Msg. 302029 of 302059
(Reply to 302028 by mrrrfk)

Dodge and weave. Run and hide. Everything you're pointing to could be done years ago by little tiny Clearmethods hiding in MIT working on defense projects.

It's a markup language that does what HTML5 won't be able to do for many many years to come.

So why? How is it Water being worked in MIT for the defense industry could already do all the things you so proudly claim HTML5 will one day do? I would think you would be really thrilled to see XML markup pulling off what all those other languages could do. It would mean HTML5 could then easily load up all those methods and be used just like HTML.

Isn't that what you wanted? Isn't that what Steve Jobs wanted? Isn't that what all your developer buddies wanted? How is it when you're handed something in 2003 you all cry that's not what you want and you invent HTML5 to one day in 2022 do what XML could do?


By: johnnnyri 10 Jun 2011, 04:59 PM EDT
Msg. 302030 of 302059
(Reply to 302028 by mrrrfk)


how does it feel to be right anout this POS stock for 11 years?

if you were a good guy you would teach all these moron pimps some of your vast technical knowledge.

you are one of the very few honest posters here. this shines through daily like a brilliant star.


By: moonpunk 10 Jun 2011, 05:00 PM EDT
Msg. 302031 of 302059
(Reply to 302030 by johnnnyri)

johnnyri How does it feel to have such a putz for a hero? Maybe you like that kind of thing.


By: mrrrfk 10 Jun 2011, 05:01 PM EDT
Msg. 302032 of 302059
(Reply to 302029 by moonpunk)

"Everything you're pointing to could be done years ago by little tiny Clearmethods hiding in MIT working on defense projects. "

Ahh, when you can't back up your BS, there's always the stealth argument. Yeah, it's all happening in "hiding". LOL. Pathetic.


By: moonpunk 10 Jun 2011, 05:05 PM EDT
Msg. 302033 of 302059
(Reply to 302032 by mrrrfk)

No. Just saying what Clearmethods said back in 2003.

How is it when you can't reply you always try to change the subject?

Show us an example of HTML5 doing what Water was doing in 2003.

Heck I'll give you a break. Show us an example of HTML5 doing what Water was doing in 2007.


By: mrrrfk 10 Jun 2011, 05:14 PM EDT

Msg. 302034 of 302059
(Reply to 302033 by moonpunk)

Water wasn't doing much of anything in 2003, and it isn't being used for much of anything now. The creators of Water have been working for TextMyFood since 2009, which BTW uses HTML5 along other technologies like Ruby-on-Rails. HTML5 is the designated standard for Web application development. Why do you insist on living in the past? Nobody cares about Water, except you.
BTW, the group went defunct and haven't had a meeting in over a year.They are all probably programming in Ruby and learning HTML5 now. LOL.


By: moonpunk 10 Jun 2011, 05:37 PM EDT
Msg. 302036 of 302059
(Reply to 302034 by mrrrfk)

Actually the language was functional in 2003 and HTML5 is still struggling.

Everybody here cares about finding out how VCSY's technology would work. Clearmethods Water/Steam is the closest we can find to fitting what the VCSY patents say. It's a much easier language because it only requires a few lines to do what it takes four times in javascript to do.

But what do you care right? You're a developer and the more lines of code you have to write the more you get paid so I can see why you're fighting this so hard.

The web industry needs a new way to program and markup programming seems to be what they want. MIT seems to have settled on using XML. You developers seem to not know how to use XML. "Too hard" you say. So you have to have something made for you so you can work.

Meanwhile defense contractors are doing with XML what you claim HTML5 is supposed to do. That's what I've suspected VCSY IP has been doing all along. HTML5 was made to attempt to compete. So far nothing.


By: moonpunk 10 Jun 2011, 06:15 PM EDT
Msg. 302042 of 302059

mirror HTML5 examples please?


By: mrrrfk 10 Jun 2011, 06:31 PM EDT
Msg. 302043 of 302059
(Reply to 302042 by moonpunk)

HTML5 is not a programming language, and doesn't try to be. It is a markup language with hooks and built-in API's so real programmers can use real programming languages with it, depending on what language is the best fit. Developers know better than to try and use a mark-up language like XML or HTML to do intense logic or automation. HTML5 in conjunction with Java, javascript, C++, perl, ruby, etc. is what developers are migrating towards. The XML-based programming fad has been mostly abandoned, though there is still some of that junk still around, of course. XML will continue to be mostly used for what it was designed for, simple text data management.
You need to get out of the past, Mr. Visionary. LOL.
Emily who?


By: moonpunk 10 Jun 2011, 06:37 PM EDT
Msg. 302044 of 302059
(Reply to 302043 by mrrrfk)

"and doesn't try to be"

That's not what you said all last year. You even point to Web Workers to show that HTML5 is intended to run automation. Didn't you argue all that time that HTML5 was going to take over automation using web applications?

Strange. I could swear that's what you were saying all last year. Have you changed your tune again?

"The XML-based programming fad has been mostly abandoned, though there is still some of that junk still around, of course."

Yeah. In MIT. In the US Air Force. In the US Army. In IBM. In Teledyne. In General Dynamics.

I guess you don't read much. Maybe that's why you don't know these things.


By: moonpunk 10 Jun 2011, 06:43 PM EDT
Msg. 302045 of 302059
(Reply to 302043 by mrrrfk)

mirror says "The XML-based programming fad has been mostly abandoned, though there is still some of that junk still around, of course. XML will continue to be mostly used for what it was designed for, simple text data management."

Somebody needs to tell that to the US Government. Somebody sold them a load of goods. Contact mirror and he'll tell all of you where you went wrong.



By: interwovenkills 10 Jun 2011, 06:45 PM EDT
Msg. 302046 of 302059
(Reply to 302044 by moonpunk)

HTML5's web workers feature is intended to allow scripts written in JavaScript (or other languages) to run in the background (i.e. automation) but HTML5 calls and coordinates those scripts, but the code that actually does the background script logic is written in a real programming language and the results can be passed back to the HTML5 user if necessary.
Must I teach you everything? I suggest you read up on HTML5, since you are supposed to be a visionary tech guru.

Computing with JavaScript Web Workers

Web Workers are, undoubtedly, the coolest new feature to arrive in the latest version of web browsers. Web Workers allow you to run JavaScript in parallel on a web page, without blocking the user interface.

Normally in order to achieve any sort of computation using JavaScript you would need to break your jobs up into tiny chunks and split their execution apart using timers. This is both slow and unimpressive (since you can't actually run anything in parallel - more information on this in How JavaScript Timers Work).

With our current situation in mind, let's dig in to Web Workers.

Web Workers
The Web Worker recommendation is partially based off of the prior work done by the Gears team on their WorkerPool Module. The idea has since grown and been tweaked to become a full recommendation.

A 'worker' is a script that will be loaded and executed in the background. Web Workers provide a way to do this seamlessly, for example:

new Worker("worker.js");
The above will load the script, located at 'worker.js', and execute it in the background.

There are some HUGE stipulations, though:

Workers don't have access to the DOM. No document, getElementById, etc. (The notable exceptions are setTimeout, setInterval, and XMLHttpRequest.)
Workers don't have direct access to the 'parent' page.
With these points in mind the big question should be: How do you actually use a worker and what is it useful for?

You use a worker by communicating with it using messages. All browsers support passing in a string message (Firefox 3.5 also supports passing in JSON-compatible objects). This message will be communicated to the worker (the worker can also communicate messages back to the parent page). This is the extent to which communication can occur.

The message passing is done using the postMessage API, working like this:

var worker = new Worker("worker.js");
// Watch for messages from the worker
worker.onmessage = function(e){
// The message from the client:


The Client:

onmessage = function(e){
if ( === "start" ) {
// Do some computation
function done(){
// Send back the results to the parent page

This particular message-passing limitation is in place for a number of reasons: It keeps the child worker running securely (since it can't, blatantly, affect a parent script) and it keeps the parent page thread-safe (having the DOM be thread safe would be a logistical nightmare for browser developers).

Right now Web Workers are implemented by Firefox 3.5 and Safari 4. They've also landed in the latest Chromium nightlies. Most people would balk when hearing this (only two released browsers!) but this shouldn't be a concern. Workers allow you to take a normal piece of computation and highly parallelize it. In this way you can easily have two versions of a script (one that runs in older browsers and one that runs in a worker, if it's available). Newer browsers will just run that much faster.

Some interesting demos have already been created that utilize this new API.


By: moonpunk 10 Jun 2011, 06:51 PM EDT
Msg. 302047 of 302059
(Reply to 302046 by interwovenkills)

Oh look it's mirror posting with another Raging Bull username. I thought you said you don't do that mirror? Getting desperate? Desperate enough to risk being banned from Raging Bull? That would probably be what you want since you could tell your bakers you can't post anymore.

By the way your claims about Watson are a distorted half truth as usual. The analytics might be written in languages like Java and C++ but the underlying foundation for Watson's semantic data is done in OWL.

You need to apologize for trying to trick people reading your posts.


By: moonpunk
10 Jun 2011, 07:01 PM EDT
Rating: You rated it:

Msg. 302048 of 302059
(Reply to 302046 by interwovenkills)
(broken link)


By: moonpunk 10 Jun 2011, 07:03 PM EDT
Msg. 302049 of 302059
(Reply to 302048 by moonpunk)

mirror We can just let people read your posts in that and other threads to know what kind of person they're dealing with. People should put you on ignore to keep from having to try to tell what's truth and what's deception. Oh and they should ignore Interwovenkills because it's simply you in another username. And that's something that is definitely a Terms of Service violation.


By: mrrrfk 10 Jun 2011, 07:16 PM EDT
Msg. 302050 of 302059
(Reply to 302049 by moonpunk)

Where does it say that using a new name is a TOS offense? It is alway pretty obvious who I am, just like it is always obvious who you are. I'm starting to get tired of mrrrfk, aren't you? Don't worry, I'm not trying to trick you. LOL.


By: moonpunk 10 Jun 2011, 08:26 PM EDT
Msg. 302051 of 302059
(Reply to 302008 by mrrrfk)

mirror So you lied to people? Really? You thought you could get away with it? Seriously? Who do you think you are?


By: moonpunk 10 Jun 2011, 08:32 PM EDT
Msg. 302052 of 302059
(Reply to 302008 by mrrrfk)

This is what you said on post 302008:

You are replying to mrrrfk's message, shown below: (Scroll past this message) By: mrrrfk
10 Jun 2011, 02:52 PM EDT Msg. 302008 of 302051
(Msg. is a reply to 302005 by moonpunk.) Nope. TextMyFood is based on Ruby-on-Rails, a real modern-day programming language, not Water.
Their LinkedIn accounts tell us this:
(broken link)

When you go to that link it says this:

Enterprise SEO - Own Page One! Optimize Your Website's Visibility in Search Engines. - From Team Pure Visibility

« Go back to Search Results
« Prev
Next »


Architect / CTO at TextMyFood

Greater Boston Area
Computer Software



Architect / CTO at TextMyFood


Consultant / Architect at CORE Business Technologies
CTO at Clear Methods
Project / Development Manager at Bowstreet

see all...

Massachusetts Institute of Technology
Massachusetts Institute of Technology - Sloan School of Management

142 connections


Expanded profile views are available only to premium account holders. Upgrade your account.

Highly adept, visionary, MIT educated technology executive with business and technical acumen, forging solid relationships with clients and technical personnel. Focused on end-to-end software product development and the design/promotion of new technology products to increase company revenues for start-up and growth organizations. Extensive experience in both development and business including client relationship management, product management, and technology development processes. Demonstrated success in building and leading cross-functional teams working on cutting-edge technology. Expert in usability, prototyping, and interface design for adaptable Web-based interfaces, point-of-sale systems, and rich-client applications.

System Architecture, Product Strategy, Software Development, Business Strategy, Prototyping, Information Architecture, Project Management, Bridging business and tech, Graphic design

No Ruby on Rails

DO YOU SEE RUBY ON RAILS THERE? No. Why? Did you intend to deceive readers? Or was this just another of your careless "accidents"?

No wonder you posted what you did when I asked somebody to open up that link. You really think people are stupid don't you?


By: moonpunk 10 Jun 2011, 08:33 PM EDT
Msg. 302053 of 302059

You people really need to think every time you open a post by mrrrfk aka Interwovenkills. Anybody who takes him seriously is nothing but a scammer


By: mrrrfk 10 Jun 2011, 08:39 PM EDT
Msg. 302054 of 302059
(Reply to 302052 by moonpunk)

Try the founder's link, Audrey J, and you will see the references to RoR. The ClearMethods dudes work for him now. Audry J is the founder of TextMyFood.

To get to it directly, try:
(broken link)


By: dartanyion 10 Jun 2011, 08:43 PM EDT
Msg. 302055 of 302059
(Reply to 302050 by mrrrfk)

I really hate to break it to you mrrrfk's but if we click on the TOS(triangle) one of the selections is multiple aliases, so "yes" it is a TOS offense...


By: stockwabbit 10 Jun 2011, 08:48 PM EDT
Msg. 302057 of 302059
(Reply to 302055 by dartanyion)




By: mrrrfk 10 Jun 2011, 08:51 PM EDT
Msg. 302058 of 302059
(Reply to 302055 by dartanyion)

dartanyion, thanks for letting me know. I don't TOS people much so I didn't see that. The actual Terms & Conditions link at the bottom of this page doesn't mention multiple aliases. I don't think so, anyway - it's freaking long! LOL.


By: moonpunk 10 Jun 2011, 08:53 PM EDT
Msg. 302059 of 302059

Don't report him just yet. Let's keep him around. It's fun to see just how much he doesn't know.


And to make sure nothing is left misunderstood.

Posted by Portuno Diamo at 6:43 PM EDT
Updated: Sunday, 12 June 2011 6:59 PM EDT
Post Comment | Permalink
Thursday, 9 July 2009
The worm turns.
Mood:  cool
Now Playing: "La Bamba" Horizontal Samba talent show (celebrity contestants)
Topic: The Sneaky Runarounds

I've been waiting for this behaviour to become manifest for a long time.


By: arthurarnsley01  
09 Jul 2009, 02:02 PM EDT 
Rating: post rating 2
Msg. 249607 of 249646 
(Reply to 249600 by dabbler3248
Jump to msg. #  

Dabbler, MSFT may have bought ‘744 from VCSY. 

There is one aspect of the Markham hearing that is a bit of a worry. If MS had gone into the Markham hearing and won then the patent would have been voided. After that every company in the world could have used '744 for free. By avoiding the Markham hearing and paying VCSY $2.9 million for use of the patent MS validated the patent so that no other company could use the patent without buying a license and paying royalties to VCSY. 

So MS effectively bought the patent from VCSY for the “chump change” others have mentioned. Isn’t that a dreadful thought? MSFT owns ‘744 and VCSY is out in the cold. That is the way this scenario has unfolded. VCSY may not be in a position to enforce patent ‘744 with any other company that wants to use it because those other companies can now come in the back door and use Microsoft’s Markham defense to avoid paying fees or royalties to VCSY. Google would be home free using ‘744. 

So where is the upside for VCSY in all this? There may not be one. It does not seem credible that VCSY won anything in its lawsuit against MSFT and instead may have lost everything. After all is said and done, VCSY claimed the settlement details were confidential, as in, did you want this chump change in $50’s or $100’s? 

On top of all that, NOW Solutions’ revenue is shrinking and the time clock acquisition may be a finger in the dyke effort to turn NOW into profitability. 

Perhaps VCSY is overpriced at .018. 



A squeak in the night. The hinge on the gate.  

Posted by Portuno Diamo at 10:32 PM EDT
Updated: Thursday, 9 July 2009 10:40 PM EDT
Post Comment | Permalink
Sunday, 28 September 2008
Now that we bought a deadbolt, the neighbors aren't "dropping in" like they used to.
Mood:  don't ask
Now Playing: Somebody's been sleeping in my bed! - Fairytale ending to home invasion scenarios (adult fantasies)
Topic: The Sneaky Runarounds

 Hey everybody! How about a big tepid bowl of ignorant soup?

Now that Microsoft is an ally in protecting the validity of patent 6826744, we can go back to the past and see what kinds of brilliant analysis the software industry had to rely on to protect them from stumbling into a bear trap.

The following comments are from a news blurb April 2007 announcing VCSY had sued Microsoft for infringement of 6826844. I am placing these here because someone on Raging Bull VCSY board posted the article and pointed out some material in one of the posts:

I attempted to post all this on Yahoo VCSY board, but the Yahoo board froze up when I tried to post the first segment, so, I thought I might leave this little bag of flaming poo here so everyone will have some idea what it's like to listen in on a gang of thugs disappointed they won't get a chance to break into your house and cart off everything you've worked hard to achieve.


>>  #1 Posted by Quick Reply on 21 Apr 2007 - 15:55
These definitions are way too vague! Been on notice since February 7? That's plenty of notice, even though .NET framework has been around since 2002! <<

And since the patent was applied for in 1999, plenty had the opportunity to build their own versions of the patent claims to see how they worked. Apparently, Microsoft liked what they saw. I wonder how many are now in the telescopic sights of Raymond Niro and Charles Wade?

>>#2 Posted by noroom on 21 Apr 2007 - 15:56
Booo! Down with software patents! <<

Hissss. Down with people who want to rip off pioneering IP. Give 'em the razzberry!

>>#3 Posted by superhuman on 21 Apr 2007 - 15:57
This is Funny. XML is an open specification. Everyone can use it to build their website. I am not sure why they let them patent it. <<

"Everyone can use XML to build their website." What's funny is you didn't have any idea what that patent said about processing XML. That's why you sound so ignorant now.

>>#4 Posted by ahhell on 21 Apr 2007 - 16:14
MS is going to eat that company for breakfast. <<

Want some bacon with that egg on your face?

>>#5 Posted by chaosblade on 21 Apr 2007 - 16:30
MS is going to buy that company for breakfast <<

Did they leave a tip? Yeah. Here's a tip. Don't talk about things you know nothing about.

>>#6 Posted by +ECEGatorTuro on 21 Apr 2007 - 17:06
MS is going to crap that company out a few hours after breakfast.<<

That was some dump, booboo. Sure you don't need a forklift to get you off that commode?

>>#7 Posted by XeonBuilder on 21 Apr 2007 - 17:12
Are they kidding me?

Everyone wants a piece of Bill pie... How he does buy them and sells them on eBay. <<

But Bill didn't buy them, did he? He settled with them. The day before the Markman Hearing... and you know what that means.

>>#8 Posted by +GreyWolfSC on 21 Apr 2007 - 17:33
What a load. They need to line up suits against the entire computer industry. AJAX is a framework, as is Java, Ruby, HTML, and almost every other programming environment ever used. I wish MS could countersue for harassment.

EDIT: Here's Vertical's company description:

"Vertical Computer Systems, Inc. (VCSY) is a provider of Internet core technologies, administrative software, and derivative software application products through its distribution network."

Now, everyone that their software is derived from can just steamroll right over them since they opened the door.


Their stock is worth 2 cents! lol

Last edited by GreyWolfSC on 21 Apr 2007 - 17:58<<

That's right. The entire industry. It's what we had been warning you clinks for years before. Steamroll over VCSY? I don't think so, fat girl. That rolling sound is just you dropping your doughnut. I'm sure MSFT dearly wanted to be able to countersue VCSY for harrassment, but that's not how it went for Mister Softee. The judge signed off on the case and therefore cancelled any further discussion with extreme prejudice. Case closed. NEXT!

>>  #9 Posted by +azcodemonkey on 21 Apr 2007 - 17:56
LOL I'm completely certain that there is prior art. I worked with a company around the same time that was doing the same thing -- wrapping arbitrary objects or using "pointers" to objects/data for use in a web portal. Who wasn't doing this in 1999?

Everyone working with the current web tech at the time saw a need for this kind of thing and grew their own. I really don't know how they expect to win. The .NET Framework isn't really like Vertical's tech at all. Sharepoint/web parts, on the other hand, seems more like what Vertical has produced. .NET, you still have to do a lot of work to achieve what Vertical's patent covers. Besides, architecture is architecture. Using components in the web was a natural progression from classic ASP inline script or static html. I guess Vertical should sue Plumtree, Sun, BEA and the rest of the world for this one. <<

Everybody? 1999? Are you sure about that, doc? That's funny. There were only a select group of software pioneers aware of XML back in 1999 and you're saying "Everyone working with the current web tech at the time saw a need for this kind of thing and grew their own."?  Want a little XML history?
XML Development History - Historical events in and around the W3C XML Activity include Recommendations:

Want some more?
Copyright Tim Anderson January 2004
Read the paragraph on Microsoft and XML. Microsoft thought they had VCSY wrapped up.

And, by the way, the aforementioned Charles Goldfarb was among those besides IBM touting VCSY's XML solutions back in the early years. Here's a sample:

SEC Info - Vertical Computer Systems Inc - 10KSB - For 12/31/01

Dr. Charles Goldfarb, recognized authority of Markup Languages, ... to the State of Texas procurement system, in the 4th Edition of the XML Handbook. ... - 565k - Cached - Similar pages
More results from »

"The .NET Framework isn't really like Vertical's tech at all. Sharepoint/web parts, on the other hand, seems more like what Vertical has produced. .NET, you still have to do a lot of work to achieve what Vertical's patent covers."

Uhhh, you see, the idea is, Microsoft wanted .Net to BECOME what VCSY Siteflash could do. Not the wrong way around as this numbnut saw it. I wonder how he sees it now?

And, yes Virginia. Sharepoint was somwhat like SiteFlash. Now, the idea is to make Sharepoint a whole lot like SiteFlash and become a living software ecology for Windows. Thus Windows 7's humble beginnings.

Keep reading, pilgrim. You'll learn by accident. 

>>#10 Posted by NightmarE D on 21 Apr 2007 - 20:25
It's a company that isn't worth a nickel whose desperate for money.

I hate companies like this. They can't make a name for themselves so they'll try to sue another company to make a few dollars.
 #10.1 Posted by Ideas Man on 22 Apr 2007 - 01:13
Are we talking about Real here

I absolutely agree. If this was such a big deal, why wasn't the suit done back in 2002? Why is it loosers like this, Real, Eolas and the like wait years before they sue? I reckon there should be some expirary date on these things, because they almost always ask for damages in the millions, and they always sue well after the product is used by the millions, seems wrong to me.<<

Uhhhh, hello dummy. The patent was not granted until 2004. VCSY gave Microsoft a long time to get their act together and negotiate for a settlement.

"and they always sue well after the product is used by the millions, seems wrong to me" That's right. Millions. Seems fair, equitable and right to me.

>>#11 Posted by Jugalator on 21 Apr 2007 - 20:52
Haha, "arbitrary object framework"?

So in other words, they try to enforce a patent about "building websites in a modern programming language"?

Wow, I hope they won't succeed in that... <<

Haha. Haha haha. Haha hahaha hahahahaha. Hahahahahahahahaaaaaahahahahaaaaa. I don't think I'll ever stop laughing at that one.

>>#12 Posted by black_death on 21 Apr 2007 - 21:06
roflmao! this has got to be my second favourite patent infringement suite next to the MP3 one of course. who the hell works at the US patent office, elementary school drop outs? <<

Blah blah blah. The stupid ones are the ones who shoot their clueless foot while it's in their clueless mouth. This has got to be my favorite patent infringement suit (not suite you idiot) next to none.

>><#13 Posted by Jelly2003 on 21 Apr 2007 - 21:16
Step 1) Lets found a company
Step 2) Lets have an idea and patient it
Step 3) Lets stick our head in the sand
Step 4) Lets take our head out the sand

HOLY CRAP! Someone has been infringing our patient for over 5 years!

PS. How pathetic, this company doesn't even deserve the time of day.
What's their excuse? They're a "Global Web Services Provider", how could anyone who develops for the net not know about

Obviously what's happened is that the company has been bought out, and the new directors have suddenly realised that the company has these patients which can bail them out of trouble, because obviously they don't have a clue about the internet, they're not making money from it, so the only way that they can survive is by stealing from those who do know about the internet.<<

Isn't it amazing just how uninformed the loudmouths turn out to be? it's a fact of nature. Loudmouth dumbasses are made, not born.

>>#14 Posted by +Octol on 21 Apr 2007 - 21:20
Quote -
VCSY’s main administrative software product is emPath 6.3, which is developed and distributed by Now Solutions, Inc.. Vertical’s primary internet core technologies include SiteFlash™, ResponseFlash™ and the Emily XML Scripting Language, which can be used to build web services.

I can't wait for Adobe to nail these guys for trademark infringement:


Using the "Flash" name, even as part of a compound term, would be no different than using SiteWindows™" or "ResponseWindows™", and we all know how long Microsoft would let them get away with that!<<

Well, now, isn’t THAT an interesting opinion? What’s up with Adobe? Are they deaf? Hard of reading? DO you think Adobe knew what they were doing when they codenamed AIR Apollo?

VCSY: At the Epicenter of the New Truly Global Internet Revolution
All the products sold on the sites will be able to be purchased by major credit card or VCSY'swebsites' Apollo Smart Card with enhanced security and ... - 27k - Cached - Similar pages

Do you think they got the news yet. Do you think these guys commenting will ever get smart?

>>#15 Posted by water.hammer on 21 Apr 2007 - 21:48
Uber pwnage<<

I wonder if "water.hammer" pissed his leg off? Pure ownership on VCSY's behalf. The rest of you nitwits can line up and take a number. Do the peepee dance if you're in a hurry.

>>  #16 Posted by MaceX on 21 Apr 2007 - 22:16
You get 1000 people to solve a problem.

90% of them will solve the problem in some way that would infringe on a patent.

That's the problem with software patents. It stifles development in software because there is so much collusion. <<

Do you mean collusion by those in the software industry who tried to destroy VCSY? That must be what he means. Who else would VCSY collude with to have their patent granted?

>>#17 Posted by  neufuse on 22 Apr 2007 - 01:37
too bad the patent doesnt even match how the .NET framework works if you read it...... and they are "Vertical is asking for a jury trial." asking for a jury trial because they know a judge would throw it right out.. they just want to confuse people that dont understand the tech and make them think they are the same

Last edited by neufuse on 22 Apr 2007 - 01:44<<

Too bad neufuse doesn’t know a judge hears the Markman Hearing which determines by law which side of the litigation has rightful ownership of the patent claims language.The jury is just there to determine just how heinous the infringement is for the purpose of apportioning damages.

>>#18 Posted by theh0g on 22 Apr 2007 - 11:53
Don't software patents ever expire? <<

Sure. The Siteflash patent will expire around 2024. Are you going to hold it that long? You'll bust a kidney, you know...

>>#19 Posted by zivan56 on 22 Apr 2007 - 18:15
Wouldn't Java be violating this as well then?<<

Well now, it all depends on what you're doing with Java, Einstein. If you're imitating the claims of the 644 patent with Java then Yes. If not, then No.

(end selections)


Posted by Portuno Diamo at 2:45 AM EDT
Updated: Sunday, 28 September 2008 12:20 PM EDT
Post Comment | Permalink
Tuesday, 29 May 2007
Forget the bipolar bears, it's the icebergs that will get us.
Mood:  a-ok
Now Playing: 'North to Santa Barbara' World situation heats up for eskimos in the sun light.
Topic: The Sneaky Runarounds


The following dated fragments come from the Timeline Vershtinken (see sidebar) which is a compendium of only a few interesting coincidental datings clustered around Microsoft, their efforts toward a web-based client which never materialized, and VCSY intellectual property awards.

August 18, 2004 VCSY SiteFlash Patent allowance
(date approximated by subtracting example 104 day span on Enabler patent allowance/granted cycle)
[see March 28, 2006]

August 27, 2004 Longhorn rewrite announced. Winfs out of Longhorn

November 11, 2004 Ballmer throws chair during meeting with Lucovsky

November 18, 2004 Ballmer accuses Linux of violating >258 patents

November 30, 2004 VCSY SiteFlash Patent granted

The marginalization of those developers who know what Longhorn was about (as opposed to “journalists” who write what they're told and don't bother looking into details) and what Microsoft intended Longhorn and all the other lost qualities that were to make up Vista, has begun.



May 25, 2007

Longhorn Reloaded: Nostalgia Run Amok
Filed under: Windows Vista
Posted by Randall Kennedy on May 25, 2007 08:28 AM


...for some people the memories are so compelling that they simply don't know how to "let go." Take the case of the "Longhorn Reloaded" project. These poor souls are so tortured by Microsoft's decision to abandon portions of the original Windows "Longhorn" vision that they've taken it upon themselves to "complete" Microsoft's work by delivering a rogue version of the Windows OS they believe "Longhorn" could have become.

...Why? Why resurrect the unfinished code base of a BETA OS (LHR, as they call it, is based on the WinHEC 2004 pre-release build 4074) that Microsoft shelved over 3 years ago?

...folks... believe that Microsoft abandoned the "Longhorn" effort prematurely and that the product they delivered last year - Windows Vista - is a mere shadow of the original vision.

More at URL


Hmmm. Clever but not correct. It follows the Microsoft issued line of 2004 which has been shown to be self-serving and deflective.

Just to even the playing field, I thought I might take this opportunity to put a few surveyor spikes down so we can take at least a couple benchmarks to get a lay of the land, so to speak.


The first [1] is "What's Next" Should Be "What's Now" from February 2004 by Joe Wilcox, then a writer for Jupiter Research.

The next [2] regards “Longhorn Reloaded” from 2004. Longhorn reloaded is a curious phrase that happens to coincide with development of the cut versions of Microsoft Longhorn by outside developers over a recent seven (you read right 7) month period, achieving what Microsoft has not been able to accomplish in many years with very much money.

The next [3] is a Raging Bull VCSY Message Board post by myself (as Ajax203) writing at the time as Ajax203. My various usernames were necessary as numerous anti-VCSY posters infested the board and would goad others into arguments in order to have those posters removed by Raging Bull for violating Terms Of Service (TOS) conditions not connected with the discussion at hand. It's been guerilla posting on VCSY Raging Bull for seven (you read right 7) years with many of the original anti-VCSY people like DC-Steve and recy43 no longer operational under those names at least.

Why am I telling you this? Well, first, if you are a veteran of the posting wars, this is a set of triangulation markers so we can refresh our understanding as to what has taken place over the years.

If you are a newbie and don't know (probably don't really care except somebody shoved some info in your face and you're now curious) you've got a very long way to go before you will understand very much about what you're looking at. Lots of luck. You're going to need it. BUT, it may be some of the most valuable investigation and due diligence you will likely ever do.

yers truly - portuno

To Wit:



February 25, 2004
By Joe Wilcox
"What's Next" Should Be "What's Now"

Once again, Microsoft is on the "What’s Next" trail instead of "What’s Now." Longhorn evangelism videos, here, show the next-generation Windows capabilities applied to healthcare and real estate; ...

...I see Microsoft as spending too much time talking about Longhorn when it’s Windows XP that matters right now. Two weeks ago, I blogged on the failure of Windows XP evangelism, after taking a cue from colleague Michael Gartenberg (here and here). Yesterday, I blogged about Microsoft’s stance on security, which, related to Longhorn evangelism, is about how new products will solve existing problems.

The "future products will solve your existing problems" message is well worn out by Microsoft.



More at URL


March 03, 2004
By Joe Wilcox
Longhorn Reloaded

About two months ago, I started warning folks to watch for a major Windows Longhorn retrenchment in early 2004. I had expected Microsoft to seriously rethink its larger Longhorn strategy and make changes potentially as colossal as .Net. Around the beginning of the millennium, Microsoft made .Net into a "bet the company" strategy, but later backed away from its boldest ambitions: Moving into the subscription content and Web services market. Microsoft execs also have talked about betting the company on Longhorn.

I would consider last week’s Windows XP Reloaded announcement the first step in the Longhorn retrenchment process.

Longhorn is Microsoft’s boldest Windows upgrade plan since the company abandoned Cairo about a decade ago. The products share many similar design goals. But Longhorn’s delivery schedule--I’ve been saying no sooner than 2006--has been looking increasingly difficult to meet. As I blogged last week, Microsoft has too many pieces to put into place to realistically meet 2006; similarly, I see the colossal number of changes coming in Windows XP Service Pack 2 as giving businesses plenty of behavioral and software changes to contend with. SP2 could further slow Windows XP upgrades.

Already, slow upgrades have plagued Windows XP. As I blogged before (here, here and here), Microsoft hasn’t effectively evangelized Windows XP. That’s not a good situation, considering the growing hype around Linux. I would consider any company using older Windows versions--that’s one in five large businesses running version 95 somewhere--as candidates for Linux experimentation.

How much or how little a threat Linux poses to Windows is a topic for an upcoming report. Whether Linux is or is not a threat is immaterial; Microsoft clearly perceives a threat. In the latter 1990s, I doubted that Netscape could steal Microsoft’s operating system crown, but Microsoft saw enough of a threat to set off the so-called browser wars.

With Linux a perceived threat now in the backdrop of slow Windows XP conversions, Microsoft has plenty of good reasons to turn up the hype around its current OS and turn down the volume on Longhorn. Microsoft also has to be concerned too much Longhorn hype could further stall Windows XP upgrades. Worse, Longhorn will usher in so many changes, many businesses might further stall upgrades.

If the company looks seriously at the failure of Windows XP evangelism, the perceived Linux threat and Longhorn’s ambitious design goals, strategy retrenchment is a sensible approach.

Some news reports already are talking about XP Reloaded leading to a delay in Longhorn’s delivery. But, I see that as having been an inevitable outcome for some time. I would look for Microsoft to either push out Longhorn’s release or deliver a less ambitious upgrade within the original schedule. At least, those are two options I would recommend the company consider.

Posted by Joe Wilcox at March 03, 2004 09:53 AM






By: ajax203
04 Jun 2006, 06:09 PM EDT
Msg. 160258 of 186163

[a] excerpted:

One thing to think about. Tim Bray made his SOA BS comment public in his blog here:
The End of SOA
Updated: 2006/04/18

(content is a rant by Tim Bray of Sun Microsystems regarding SOA as “vendor bull****” in Tim's words. I am simply passing his views to you.)

[b] excerpted:

March 29, 2006
Vertical Computer Systems, Inc. Receives a Notice of Allowance From The U.S. Patent & Trademark Office For a Patent Application Covering Various Aspects Of The XML Enabler Agent ...



More at URL


Mary Jo Foley appears to be following the Longhorn Reloaded activity in more than one place. Apparently there are a number of “nostalgic” developers out there who feel they were jilted by Microsoft's erasure of Longhorn history.



May 29th, 2007
There’s more than one way to reload Longhorn
Posted by Mary Jo Foley @ 4:37 am

The folks over at aren’t the only ones with “Longhorn” nostalgia.

Enthusiasts over at the site also are looking to bring back Longhorn, a k a, the precursor to the Windows Vista release that Microsoft launched in January 2007.

The Longhorn Reloaded team is looking to ressurect and retrofit a 2004 pre-release version of Windows so that it can be used as an alternative to Windows Vista.

The AeroXP “Vista Customization Square”/Retrophase team is looking to bring the existing Vista Aero interface to a pre-Longhorn-Reset version of Windows.

Incubating in our very forums is a project called ‘Retrophase.’ Think the reverse of ‘Longhorn Reloaded.’ Instead of bringing Windows Vista capabilities to the rotting Longhorn 4074 platform, the community is bringing Longhorn goodness to the shiny new Windows Vista platform,” blogged AeroXP member Rafael Rivera.

The Longhorn Reloaded effort kicked off in earnest last October; Retrophase started in June 2006. Last week, the Longhorn Reloaded team announced it had achieved Milestone 1 along its internally-set release timetable.

The existence of both of these projects raises a number of questions:

  • Once Microsoft “abandons” a code base, is it fair game for developers to use that code base to build a new product/technology? (I doubt Microsoft considers the Longhorn client code to be “abandonware,” as one member of suggested, but this is still an interesting point to ponder….)

  • If Microsoft doesn’t “release” code — under some kind of open/quasi-open-source license as a platform atop which developers are encouraged to tinker — as was the case with, say, Visual FoxPro (the basis for Sedna/SednaX) –can the code still be used in that way?

  • Would Microsoft be open to the “community” keeping a discontinued/older code base alive? (The Visual FoxPro folks are requesting an answer on this very issue right now, with their call for Microsoft to release the FoxPro source code so that the community can keep continue to update it.)


What is “intellectual property” children? Is it work done? Or ideas acquired and kept locked up?

Or is it something intangible like “ownership”. It appears, no matter which way Microsoft turns on this question, the wolves have the buffaloes surrounded and are now nipping at those hooved feet to bring the big boys down.




I suspect this Longhorn Reloaded issue will blow into quite a firestorm before long. It's better to be informed than ignorant and anyone who believes what was told them in 2004 should take a re-read to make sure they weren't the unwitting victim and participant in an old-school flim-flam.

January 23rd, 2007
Rewriting Vista history
Posted by Mary Jo Foley @ 12:08 pm

What would have happened, on that fateful day of August 27, 2004, if Microsoft officials had said: "You know what? We messed up with Longhorn. And we're starting over."

Instead, as Microsoft historians know, Microsoft decided to cast its decision to gut the next version of Windows client as a "reset."

"We didn't do much — just took out WinFS, the Windows File System. Oh yeah — and back-port some of the stuff that was supposed to be exclusive to Longhorn to Windows XP. Other than that, it's full-steam ahead."

As Microsoft enthusiast Robert McLaws on notes, the Longhorn reset was really more of a do-over.

The Longhorn we first heard about as early as 2002 is not the Vista that Microsoft will launch next week on January 29. Fewer of the application-programming interfaces at its core are "managed," as opposed to "native," than Microsoft originally had hoped/expected. The integrated search is less capable and game-changing than the one Microsoft initially touted. In short, the product formerly code-named Longhorn is more evolutionary than revolutionary.

Like McLaws, I am not criticizing Microsoft for changing its course. I agree with him that the big mistake was not coming clean and admitting that Longhorn, as originally outlined, wasn't going to work. The stuff we saw at the Professional Developers Conference in 2003, which was Longhorn's first coming out party, looked snazzy. But Microsoft couldn't pull it off.

Being upfront about Longhorn — and, as McLaws also suggests — changing the code-name (Windows "Shorthorn," anyone?) to indicate it was not the same product could have changed the historical course and public perception of Windows Vista.

What if:

* the Vista development clock began ticking in August 2004, instead of August 2001? Microsoft could have claimed that Vista took just over two years (instead of five) to develop.

* Microsoft could have tabled WinFS sooner (and stopped spending countless cycles to get it to work well enough to make the centerpiece of Longhorn). The Softies could have sent WinFS to the SQL Server graveyard in 2004 instead of 2006.

* Microsoft could have dedicated some of its Windows development hands to Windows XP Service Pack (SP) 3 at an earlier point in time, thereby releasing the next XP service pack in 2005 or 2006, not in 2008.

Who knows … Microsoft might even have managed to get Vista out in time for the holiday 2006 buying season if the company had just been up front in 2004 that it was going to release a relatively minor, yet more stable, Windows upgrade two years on the heels of Windows XP SP2. (As Windows chief Jim Allchin himself has said,  XP SP2 really was a new version of Windows, not just a traditional service pack.)

Sure it's a lot of should-have/could-have/would haves. But definitely something worth pondering on the eve of the Vista launch.

Update: McLaws has some comebacks on my what-if Vista-history timeline.

Things you need to ponder:

Posted by Portuno Diamo at 1:13 PM EDT
Updated: Tuesday, 29 May 2007 3:43 PM EDT
Post Comment | Permalink
Thursday, 24 May 2007
Honest Doc, I didn't know bolt cutters could do that kind of damage.
Mood:  vegas lucky
Now Playing: 'The Smell of Burnt Rawhide' Rustlers grab wrong bunch of cows. (Adventure / Calamity)
Topic: The Sneaky Runarounds

This one (just one? surely there will be plenty more) Mary Jo Foley article about a group of developers recently building out what was pulled from Longhorn years ago demonstrates the indisputable contention Microsoft HAD sophisticated Web-based XML capabilities long ago (while VCSY was in the throes of a court battle with Chinadotcom/Ross Systems that threatened to destroy Vertical) but those capabilities were taken out.

And now? Not.

In other words I contend Microsoft had a great deal of next generation functionality in Longhorn (the original Longhorn, not the gelded gilding you see in the Microsoft petting zoo today) that would have required XML enablement which is described in the XML Enabler Agent patent description (re: USPTO 7,076,521 ) (WinFS is a perfect example of enablement on the NTFS operating system files for a virtualized operating system view - a very valuable capability in its own right) and operated using methods described by the SiteFlash patent (re: USPTO 6,826,744 ) and built using a dynamic markup language and environment as described by the Emily patent application.

We see Longhorn's horns (it can go on the web or it can operate on the operating system - wow. Large spread.) and we see the tips are sharp  (the dilemma Microsoft is impaled upon - show it? don't show it? oooch ouuuch).

Where did Longhorn's productive centers go? Cut off. Cut off? That's right pilgrim. Lopped. Separated. Undone. Put in a jar. Cut nuglets just when Microsoft needed them most... cut off after November 2004. Right after the SiteFlash patent (which would be the overall ecology for the above mentioned web-based XML oeprations) was granted VCSY and right at the time Microsoft was losing a key player in their web/XML operations as Mark Lucovsky announced he was leaving to take the whole operational concept to Google (which proceded to field exactly those kinds of operations in 2005 adding billions to their market cap in the process)... all the while VCSY remained silent... writing it all down.

As it stands now, Microsoft can't get Longhorn out of the vet's office (guess can't get vetted by Microsoft lawyers - the people who know if you have the grublets to make it through the barnyard without getting pecked to incapacitation), so developers outside the company take it upon themselves (and thus take on a huge legal liability as, to this point, all software patents have not been ruled invalid by the courts of this land) to build out what Longhorn clearly was able to demonstrate and provide long ago.

I get the bubbly grits (that "gut" feeling) we're going to be seeing a number of items come out publicly that show where and when Microsoft stepped on their own boombas and realized they weren't going to be able to simply move the bull from the barn to the great outdoors.

We should start calling Longhorn "Longago". It fits better than simply 'a pile of nervous bull on the move'.

For background here is a Mary Jo post from October 2006 about the Longhorn reanimation project before you read on to the rest of the story. Imagine, seven (7) months work and these people did what Microsoft has not been able to do in three or four years. Amazing. I guess less really is more. 

May 24th, 2007

Enthusiasts progress with plans to resurrect Windows ‘Longhorn’

Posted by Mary Jo Foley @ 7:22 am Categories: Vista, Windows client, Corporate strategy, Code names Tags: Microsoft Windows, Microsoft Longhorn, Microsoft Corp., Mary Jo Foley

Seven months after announcing plans to take up where Microsoft left off with its Windows Longhorn client development, a group of members of the site have built a working protype of what they’re calling “Longhorn Reloaded.”

longhorn-reloaded.jpgEarlier this week, the Longhorn Reloaded developers and testers posted for download Milestone 1 of Longhorn Reloaded.

“Longhorn Reloaded is a Project dedicated to the revival of the Operating System known as Code Name ‘Longhorn’. To put the projects aims simply, we aim to finish off what Microsoft started before the operating system was canceled. It is a modification of Windows 6.0.4074, which was originally released during the 2004 Windows Hardware Engineers Conference,” explained the Longhorn Reloaded team on the Joejoe Web site.

For the record, Microsoft officials never claimed Longhorn, the release of Windows now known as Vista, was cancelled. Instead, Microsoft execs said they “reset” their plans for Longhorn in 2004 by decided to cut the Windows File System (WinFS) feature from the product and to use the Windows Server 2003 kernel as the core platform. But a number of developers and industry watchers have said they considered Vista to be a far cry from the operating system Microsoft originally demonsrated and described earlier this decade.

When the Longhorn Reloaded team announced its intentions to build a version of Windows built on the pre-release Build 4074 of Longhorn, many said it couldn’t be done. If technical roadblocks didn’t make the mission impossible, Microsoft’s legal department would, the critics said. (heh heh yeah we'll see)

“I would like to announce you that what no one could believe has finally reach(ed) a concrete delivery,” said Jemaho, a k a JeanMarie Houvenaghel, the founder of and supervisor of the Longhorn Reloaded project., via e-mail. “The enthusiasm for this project has never failed and is even more great now.”

I asked Jemaho for a target date as to when the team hopes to be able to deliver a “final” release of Longhorn Reloaded. No word back yet. I also asked whether Microsoft officials had expressed displeasure with what the Longhorn Reloaded team is trying to do. Also no response yet.

When I asked Microsoft about the Longhorn Reloaded team’s efforts in October 2006, here is the response I received from a Microsoft spokeswoman:

“Microsoft actively encourages and supports independent developers to take advantage of the features available in our platform to create their own applications and services; however, the Windows end user licensing agreement does not allow users to modify and redistribute our code in this manner.”

Would you be interested in trying out Longhorn Reloaded? If and when the final is out, would you consider running it?

Well, now, ain't THAT some expletives deleted?

"Enthusiasts". Hmmm. Our Very Own Troll is an enthusiast, I believe. He enthusiastically goes after large money piles held by crooks... errr... 'defendants'. Sorry. I didn't know there was womens and childrens present. heh heh Howdy ma'am. Yes ma'am, that truly is a lovely finger.

Maybe Vertical can get these nice young people to describe what all they had to put back in to the Longhorn to get it to walk without shuffling.

And for all our argumentative friends who don't think there's anything stinky about this situation, I guess I'll have to draw some pictures. Fortunately, here and A Laughing Place 3 , we have the opportunity to do just that... post pictures and drawings. It's what you have to do for some people who don't know they're standing right in the middle of a large accumulated pile of bull product. For more information see: Longhorn Reloaded 



Well, I was right as usual. There is another group trying to stuff their own image of a Longhorn with the "Retrophase" Project. I wonder why Microsoft is tolerating this invasion of their IP sanctuary unless they're afraid of going after these kinds of developments for the stink that would ensue.

Dag nabbit, Roy. Them's rustlers!

Calm down, Gabby. They're just hungry farmhands looking for a sirloin.

Well I say we needs to nail 'em up by the fuzzies!!

Posted by Portuno Diamo at 12:01 PM EDT
Updated: Tuesday, 29 May 2007 11:26 PM EDT
Post Comment | Permalink
Wednesday, 23 May 2007
Now, put this over your head and go out there and tell those people what we call the truth!
Mood:  accident prone
Now Playing: 'Walking the Peanuts' Dog walker makes $5.50 an hour dragging ten pound bag of roasted nuts on a leash. (Political Debate)
Topic: The Sneaky Runarounds

Kukla Fran and Ollie could tell M&A MBAs of today a bit about theater and tension. When things got too tense, Kukla would just grab a club and beat the hell out of poor stupid bald headed Ollie. Poor Fran was a pointless, terrified little ninny while Ollie got his knuckles thoroughly whacked. Horrible, horrible sight when you're four years old, don't you know? Of course, a four year old doesn't realize sock puppets have somebody behind the scenes making them go through the motions. Now that I've gotten significantly older, I realize I could have simply gotten up from the audience, walked up there and taken that club and whacked the crapettes out of that stupid snake.

Of course, at the time, I didn't have the significantly older muscles and attitude that would have allowed me to over-power Fran.

Reading this and knowing what we've seen about MS Ad Center and what Microsoft had to do to cover their nakedness (Apparently Microsoft's ad center had more than a hiccup from July 19, 2006) I think I know now who Ollie reminds me of today and I'm not in such a hurry to stop the snake from whacking that hairless egg. 

Did Microsoft Panic With This aQuantive Buy?

Larry Dignan (ZDNet) submits: Microsoft, loser of the DoubleClick sweepstakes and rumored to buy almost every online advertising company on the planet, is now on the bandwagon. The company acquired aQuantive for $6 billion.

Microsoft will pay all cash for aQuantive. The company paid a whopping $66.50 a share for the company. Aquantive closed at $35.87 on Thursday. The acquisition is the largest in Microsoft’s history.

In a statement the software giant said:

This deal expands upon the Company’s previously outlined vision to provide the advertising industry with a world class, Internet-wide advertising platform, as well as a set of tools and services that help its constituents generate the highest possible return on their advertising investments.

It better at that premium.

The acquisition makes Microsoft a bit of an advertising agency that can design ads and deliver them via its Adcenter platform. Seeing the writing on the wall WPP bought 24/7 Real Media on Thursday. Microsoft was allegedly interested in 24/7 Real Media, but found aQuantive more attractive.

CEO Steve Ballmer said aQuantive represents “the next step in the evolution of our ad network from our initial investment in MSN, to the broader Microsoft network including Xbox Live, Windows Live and Office Live, and now to the full capacity of the Internet.”

With aQuantive, Microsoft can manage campaigns, maximize inventory and design ads. AQuantive owns Avenue A/Razorfish, which is one of the largest design firms. In other words, Microsoft will be an advertising firm.

The online advertising industry has consolidated in short order. Google bought DoubleClick, Yahoo bought Right Media, WPP took out 24/7 and now Microsoft took aQuantive off the board.

On the surface, the integration of the two companies should be relatively easy. AQuantive, with 2,600 employees, is based in Seattle. And the capabilities and systems aQuantive brings to the table don’t overlap with Microsoft’s current structure that much. Microsoft plans to fold aQuantive into its online services unit.

Aquantive brings three primary systems to Microsoft: Atlas provides tools for publishers and advertisers to better monetize ad inventory; Drivepm matches campaigns and inventory; and Avenue A/Razorfish, which designs ads.

A few other observations:

* Did Microsoft panic with the aQuantive buy? If $3.1 billion was too pricey for DoubleClick how can it possibly justify a $6 billion takeover of aQuantive? I don’t care what synergies you cook up - the valuation is way rich.

* Watch the regulatory horse trading now. Kevin Johnson, president of Microsoft’s platform and services division, didn’t back down on the company’s argument that the Google and DoubleClick deal is anticompetitive on the merger conference call. Johnson argued that aQuantive is complementary to Microsoft while Google and DoubleClick overlap. In that argument, Microsoft will argue that Google and DoubleClick stifles competition while Microsoft’s aQuantive buy stimulates it.

I don’t get the argument to be honest. Online advertising is being consolidated among three giants–Google, Yahoo and Microsoft. My bet: Microsoft eventually shuts up about Google so it doesn’t raise concerns about the aQuantive deal.


Posted by Portuno Diamo at 9:02 PM EDT
Updated: Wednesday, 23 May 2007 11:27 PM EDT
Post Comment | Permalink
Hmmm... I guess you were right about falling from there.
Mood:  hug me
Now Playing: 'The Rubber Robber Affair' Corporate lawyer finds cell phone with 'pretty lady' on other end of the line.
Topic: The Sneaky Runarounds

I know this is going to be a bit disturbing to some of you but didn't you learn to read in school? It's really not all that much if you just look at every other word.

Ohhhh... you're disturbed about the trickery and shady dealings! Well, heck, why didn't you say so? I could have left out that part.

This a precautionary tale for those who pooh-pooh conspiracies and giants squashing bugs. And, by the way... the real world called. They want your phone number.

To wit: A sad tale of a little bitty elf and the evil giant.

December 5, 2001 Ballmer takes charge of Microsoft Phone biz

July 8, 2002 Bugs delay flagship Microsoft phone

July 11, 2002 Microsoft: our phone software might not be good enough

July 22, 2002 Microsoft's Canary phone - the first pics

October 7, 2002 Orange to launch Microsoft Smartphone in UK

September 10, 2002 Sendo ships self-destructing Stinker phone SDK

November 21, 2002 Sendo junks Microsoft smartphone, joins Nokia camp

January 6, 2003 Microsoft's masterplan to screw phone partner - full details
(Sendo's 27-page filing in a Texas court - disclosed here for the first time)

January 7, 2003 Sendo sues Microsoft over 'secret plan'

February 27, 2003 Microsoft goes on attack in Sendo case

February 27, 2003 Whatever didn't happen to Microsoft's Marc Brown?

June 5, 2003 Sendo sues Orange over Microsoft SPV smartphone IP

August 31, 2003 Microsoft's Sendo case: has it Burst wide open?
(Microsoft's case against Sendo is brutally damaged - 'missing' emails)

September 13, 2004 Microsoft settles Sendo tech theft lawsuit

March 23, 2005 Sendo reports Ericsson to EC, Ericcson sues Sendo
(accusing Ericsson of "seeking to license its patents to third parties on an unfair, anti-competitive, abusive and discriminatory basis")

June 29, 2005 Motorola buys Sendo team, patents

So, you see, boys and girls, Mister Frickaseed isn't typing all this just to entertain you. He's trying to keep your boogered eyes open and your softball brain alert. Why? So you can keep what you bought and the brain will get taught...



UPDATE May 26, 2007

Looks like Microsoft is "competing" against smaller companies again. Check out

Nasty nasty nasty. 

Posted by Portuno Diamo at 4:26 AM EDT
Updated: Saturday, 26 May 2007 12:35 PM EDT
Post Comment | Permalink
Just climb out on the branch and pick one. I'll catch you if you fall.
Mood:  vegas lucky
Now Playing: 'Not Playing Fair' Traveling circus arrives in town full of angry roller coaster enthusiasts. (Mystery / Court TV)
Topic: The Sneaky Runarounds

If I were a telephone company and I were trying to figure out what Verizon is up to, would I be scared?

Orange launches 'Business Together with Microsoft' service
Posted by Maggie Holland at 11:16AM, Tuesday 22nd May 2007

Microsoft and Orange beef up their relationship to help accelerate the use of unified communications solutions in businesses.

As part of the new offering, Orange will assess, design, implement and manage a bespoke solution, based on individual customer needs, created from a blend of current Microsoft solutions such as Office Communications Server 2007 and Exchange Server 2007.

Users will then be able to access their e-mails, voicemails, contacts and calendar information as well as making calls, all from a single Windows Outlook interface using a web browser. Real-time communication is also possible using instant messaging or audio, video or web conferencing facilities in the solution.

More at URL

Windows Outlook, huh? Hmmm... Sounds pretty minimalist if not downright risky. What will the Union say if you can't let everybody play nice? Really.

"...The first companies to benefit from 'Business Together with Microsoft' will be large multinational companies ...”

What if those companies don't want to use Microsoft stuff? Do they have any choice with Orange? Really?

And will this one-off bespoke amalgamation consist of any third-party or other software? Really?

Not if you don't have IP protection.

And how fast will it go? Really?

Not if you don't have IP protection.

Color me Ripe 

And how do you expect to automate all this? Really? 

Posted by Portuno Diamo at 1:59 AM EDT
Updated: Wednesday, 23 May 2007 2:10 AM EDT
Post Comment | Permalink
Thursday, 17 May 2007
You mind getting that?
Mood:  d'oh
Now Playing: 'Prom Date Dazzle' Sister's little brother tormented by her prom date. (Safety Training)
Topic: The Sneaky Runarounds

And, no, this isn't my last post. Actually, it's not technically a post. It's kind of like this grenade rolled by me and I'm just handing it off to you. It needs to be in Notable Opinions but this three legged thingie is pretty sparse on features, as it were, and not conducive to the categorizationing. The google (Laughing Place #3) site provides labels that would be good for searching if people like me were more conscientious and used them.

Anywho, another tricycle incident. Kid was pedalling up into tailpipes all day and somebody finally backed one up on him. That's a shame. Somebody should tell his mom.

By: peterd13
16 May 2007, 07:45 PM EDT
Msg. 185358 of 185376
(This msg. is a reply to 185300 by tepe.)


You have told us that you're not here for the very long haul - that you REALLY don't believe in this stock, and that you only invested here on a hunch without doing any DD until after the fact. And you've stated that you play 'the pennies' for short term gains...

So again, here we go:

Your post: "....If buying under 2 cents was so obvious, why wasn't eveyone doing it? The volume was in the toilet.

Sure, in retrospect I can tell anyone where they should have bought and sold a stock. But I'll bet even those who bought at under 2 cents are still holding on for the "big run"......"

To respond: It took only three days to accumulate more than 1,200,000 shares between 1.6 and 1.8 cents about 3-4 weeks prior to the Monday run up to 3.3 cents. There was plenty of volume. (Investment result: about $20,000 to buy; about $37,000 at the sell - which only took 4 minutes on that Monday....)

So, I know that you're not SERIOUS and you don't really believe that there are NO investors here that bought recently under 2 cents and sold above 3 cents.....Especially those of us, like you, who watch this stock nearly daily? The real question is (as I asked you in the post in question): "How come you didn't?!?!?!?!" I mean, to read your considerable posts over this past year, by your own words you're one savvy investor.....

Come on Tepe; this is a question of credibility!

You don't like the stock, you bash it constantly, but when there is money to be made (your stated purpose for being here, afterall....) you claim that it was just too difficult to 'see' it.....

my, would like us to read and or pay attention to what you have to say, but to follow this stock this closely for more than a year, be an in and out kind of penny stock trader, and to have not made any money here at all (to still be at a paper loss) is just absurd!!

You have ZERO credibility

'nuf said


(Voluntary Disclosure: Position- Long; ST Rating- Strong Buy; LT Rating- Strong Buy)



By: 4sirius2
16 May 2007, 10:29 PM EDT
Msg. 185366 of 185378
(This msg. is a reply to 185361 by tepe.)

Tepe, you mean you haven't even read the VCSY website or much of
the filings to know that Emily is the first product of Vertical
among all of them? Emily is the scripting language that was used
to create the XML Enabler. You might do well also to read
Portuno's older posts, start as far back as they go and move
forward to understand how integral it is, and to understand that
Emily can create many other fine products like the Enabler and
the Broker Agent. The Broker Agent? That's been around since
2000 and is in use for procurement. Get a grip, do some DD,
and stop wasting your time trying to convince the board that the
sky is falling on us. It's on you only you've had your back turned.

(Voluntary Disclosure: Position- Long; ST Rating- Strong Buy; LT Rating- Strong Buy)


MORTAR ROUND! Hey buddy, pass this over to the guy in the green pants.

By: vcsymojo
16 May 2007, 10:54 PM EDT
Msg. 185367 of 185378

The little fish is a liar. One of the biggest liars in the history of the VCSY board. Everything that comes out of his mouth is a lie. If he is a shareholder, which is extremely doubtful because of his actions, i.e., bashing the stock the day after he supposedly bought, then he owns a few hundred shares, a few dollars worth. That is only a legal ploy so when the law goes after him, as it will, then his argument will be, "No, see, I own 500 shares of VCSY. I am a disgruntled shareholder. I have the right to my freedom of speech."

No, he doesn't. Someone can't yell "FIRE" in a crowded theatre, and little disgruntled miserable humans shouldn't be able to yell "SELL" because they're getting paid $6/hour and they have no other hope to make a decent life. I'm sorry he's mentally challenged and can only post lies to make a few bucks after the shift at the Burger King ends. That's why he pops on here every night at 8pm EST. The shift for the special education adults who can't get real jobs end, and the 16 year olds take over...That's what really pisses someone like the little fish off that he has to bow down and say "yes sir" to a pimply faced 19 year old who is his shift manager. I'd be mad all the time too. I'd come on here and scream and ##### and complain because my life was horrible.

He's a liar. He's a cheap pawn in a big player's game. He's a nobody. And one day, he'll be gone. His employer will want to spend that $6/hr. elsewhere and he'll go whine and complain somewhere else.

Pathetic life.

(Voluntary Disclosure: Position- Long)

Satchel charge! Uhhh, excuse me, buddy... mind standing in the way of these twenty thousand beebees?

By: RapidRobert2
16 May 2007, 11:25 PM EDT
Msg. 185368 of 185378

(This msg. is a reply to 185361 by tepe.)

That is simply more nonsense and false information from you. The 'XML Enabler' PATENT is not 'emily'...that is patent PENDING. Understand? 'EMILY' is PATENT PENDING, DUH!

Of course, what else do you have except False Information to bash with?

NOW, you show you don't even KNOW about the software that IS owned BY VCSY and YOU continue to BASH as if you do.

Well, by YOUR own posts, you ARE irrelevant since we NOW KNOW you do NOT even understand the technology of VCSY. YOU do NOT even understand the "patent" system and the courts. MSFT already tried with a 'CHALLENGE' and LOST...understand that LOST the CHALLENGE against the technology of VCSY.

microsoft WILL SIGN the LICENSE with Vertical Computer Systems and perhaps even PAY annual ROYALTY fees.

And, you bought FOUR times over MONTHS during the last YEAR, as you state, and still blame someone else for your not doing any research over all THOSE MONTHS.

You ARE NOT a shareholder, just a basher out to harm VCSY and attack supporters of VCSY.

Thanks for showing your LACK of KNOWledge. You fail even to understand the basics of the technology of VCSY and have claimed the 'Fiber Optic' patent won't work and you DO NOT even understand it or ANY VCSY PATENTS or the one PATENT PENDING...Don't go down the road trying to blame others for your LACK of KNOWledge. That won't work with the way you BASH this company.



Oh, it's a scene, man. Kung Foo with goo foo.

Posted by Portuno Diamo at 2:38 AM EDT
Updated: Thursday, 17 May 2007 3:25 AM EDT
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Wednesday, 16 May 2007
My back pages...
Mood:  hug me
Now Playing: 'It Fell From The Sky' Found object causes dithering in political circles. (Crime/Drama)
Topic: The Sneaky Runarounds

NO. THIS is not the last post. It's technically not really a post because all I'm going to do here is record for posteriors what was said. I will post in my last post that I think this sounds like a change of de facto leadership where no facto is needed. The statements show enough. I would think "good cop bad cop" except this sounds more like a struggle with "smart cop stupid cop".

We'll patiently watch the wrastling match in the store window for entertainment and info. Meanwhile, just some leaflets blown from the tree of life;

To Wit: 

May 16th, 2007

Microsoft: If we’re violating IP, ‘we’ll take a license’

Posted by Mary Jo Foley @ 9:53 am

On May 13, Microsoft finally put a number behind its previous claims that open-source software violated Microsoft patents. In an article published in Fortune Magazine, Microsoft IP lawyers claimed that free and open-source software (FOSS) violates 235 Microsoft patents.

Now, courtesy of the same Microsoft public-relations representative who provided us press/blogger folks with Microsoft’s full statement on May 14 on its latest patent-infringement claims, here are a couple more Microsoft sound bites on this issue.

Q: What kinds of tools/processes did Microsoft use to determine which open-source code allegedly infringe on Microsoft’s patents?

A: No further details are available at this time.

Q: Some in the industry are saying that this isn’t a one-way street — that Microsoft’s technology likely infringes on open source patents. What’s Microsoft’s response to that?

A: “In 2003 Microsoft announced that we were open for business and would license our IP to all comers including open source. Our patent portfolio scores very high on patent quality and science linkage ( As you may know
Microsoft also licenses in the third party patent rights we need to stand behind our products and offer our customers industry leading IP indemnification.

“In the past three years we have paid more than $1.4 billion to license third party patent rights. If a company is interested in using Microsoft’s IP to innovate in the marketplace they should come talk to us. Conversely, if a company believes we are using its IP they should come talk to us as well. If it is true we will take a license. That is how innovation industries work. Everyone should play by the same rules.”

Q: Why is Microsoft going public with more specifics — in terms of numbers and general technology areas allegedly infringing on your patents — now? Why this week?

A: “The latest draft of the GPLv3 attempts to tear down the bridge that Microsoft and Novell have built between proprietary and open source software. Now that we have a solution in place we’re discussing the patent issue more directly in an effort to call attention to the problem and emphasize the important need for the bridge in a world where many customers have mixed technology solutions.

“The patent issue has been recognized by others in the industry. Richard Stallman, the founder of the Free Software Foundation, and other free software leaders believe there is overlap between our IP portfolio and various open source software components. This is further supported by a review done by the Open Source-lead Open Source Risk Management group indicating areas of IP overlap between major software vendors and open source.

“Now that we have built a bridge our focus is on making it work.”

That’s one heck of a strategy for building bridges between proprietary and open source. Looks more like bombing bridges, to me….

I’m still waiting to see what Bill Hilf, Microsoft’s general manager of platform strategy, is going to say about all this. Hilf posted to the Microsoft Port 25 blog that he was misquoted on various inflammatory statements about Linux, which were published in Bangkok the same time that Microsoft went public with its patent-infringement claims in Fortune. But so far, Hilf’s been mum on Microsoft’s IP lawyers’ comments.

And if you don't mind, I'll drop these keys here just for storage. No place to keep them right now until I straighten up the place for new boarders.
Note: Raging Bull "technical glitch" 'destroyed' posts before January 21, 2003.

Posted by Portuno Diamo at 3:14 PM EDT
Updated: Wednesday, 16 May 2007 3:23 PM EDT
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